You're listening to the Redcast. If it's radical, we cover it. Here's your host, Ryan Ulfer. Because it's Ryan Ulfer welcome to another episode I am stoked about the podcast. Everything, I feel like everything this time of year is just that slam time where everything's bumping up against next week. Next week, everything is going to go silent for the next two weeks. Right now, it's scramble. We are here, as always, at Comradri, the co-works base in Greenville, one of our sister companies and the podcast studio. And so Robbie Fitzwater joins me today. He is our growth marketing strategist here at Radical amongst several other daily duties that Robbie has, including somewhat of a new father, but welcome. Trying to figure that out. Yeah, it's good to be here. Robbie has a really detailed background on the marketing side, which we'll get into. He's also an ag-junct lecturer. Am I saying that correctly now? So I think I need to change it on my LinkedIn. It's technically lecture. So just lecture, straight lecture now. Yeah, so he's lecturing daily or daily here at Radical, but on the regular at Clipson University. So, we don't just bring in people that say they know what they're doing. We bring in lectures that are telling our youth how to do it. Hopefully, I'm educating the youth well enough, but yeah, the Clipson MBA program. So not just not always youths. A lot of times they're actually older than I am, but oh, you never go. It's always fun and get to talk about marketing. I enjoy it. I can talk for days. So yeah, talk about digital marketing strategy last semester and social media strategy next semester. So oh boy, I love it. Well, you get to somewhat practice what you're preaching, both here at Radical, but then you get to preach there and practice here and elsewhere. So you're getting it all in. It keeps me fresh on the real world perspective side and then it keeps the content relevant on the on the teaching side. What's interesting about that is you would just go down a bunny rabbit hole here early. That was the biggest miss for me, you know, a college at Clipson. I was like, these professors are like, I feel like they're wise, but not smart. If that makes any sense, I was like, I feel like what they're telling me is there's wisdom here, but I'm not sure how practical it is. So that was actually my rub, and that's one of the reasons I wanted to get into teaching. It was the gap that's happening. I previously, and again, before a few years ago was actually the director of social media for Clipson University. So I don't want to get like can get into background later, but was it Clipson University for a while? And while I was there, I always had a content team of student content creators that were on our team. They were kind of in the weeds, making the donuts for our to develop content for the university. So it was great for them. They got a great experience and they learned a lot of the tools and skills they would need to use later on. They would all go on and get sexy marketing jobs. A lot of other marketing students weren't necessarily always getting marketing jobs because they're competitive. It's a bloodbath for marketing jobs. But for educators on the marketing side, it's tough because marketing digital marketing in general is a complete dumpster fire as a practitioner. Like you've got to work really hard to keep up. Let alone as an educator where you're trying to do a bunch of different things and then teach people how to do stuff. So just the space in general doesn't lend itself as well towards learning how to do it. And that was one of the reasons I wanted to get into teaching is if you can find kind of unpack what some of the durable ideas are about certain topic areas, then and make it translatable to people who aren't necessarily like foreign bread marketers, it will translate better for them and they'll be able to kind of take that and run with it and be way better marketer than I ever will be in the category they're looking to get into. Yeah, that's definitely unique for I think most university. I mean, I think they're starting to get there, but it's definitely was not my perspective coming through school and you know, I think there needs to be a lot more of that. So I think that's great for the students of all ages there. And it's always fun because ever before I did this, every while I was at Clemson, I would always get to speak in like one semester, I spoke at 22 class classes just because there's there's teachers across the university who want to teach this content to their students, but they they've never been in that role themselves. So getting to hear from a real practitioner really helped the students and really hopefully helps helps the teacher kind of gain different perspective, but it was always just a blast to kind of get to help them learn and then kind of help them connect the dots of, okay, this isn't super complicated when you kind of boil it down, like SEO, search engine optimization, it's kind of like a credit score. It has multiple variables that impact your credit score. So if you can understand that, you can understand to kind of unpack what what these things entail or like for social or any digital channel. Yeah, you get a lot of eyeballs in the front end, but if that channel makes money from your eyeballs, that that channel is going to become more and more, it's going to become harder and harder to reach people as time goes on because they need to monetize that platform. So you can kind of predict the way those things are going to move. And if you have some of the durable ideas, you can really start to apply them in different ways. I love it. So Robbie, you know, I know we wanted to get into some of the foundational things that you preach to our clients around content, around social media, around, you know, performance and growth marketing, but maybe we've done it a little bit because we don't write it into the college but maybe give everyone that's listening, you know, the the background on you and, you know, why the hell you're so damn smart. I'm, I'm crushing your judgment when you call me smart. As a dumbest thing anybody can say, no, no, I'm kidding, but I started, I was really lucky, I started doing marketing when I was in college. I was a, I worked at a running shoe store in Fayetteville, Arkansas. And I, this was 2007, 2008, like early days of Facebook. So Facebook was still the dark ages at that point. So we decided to create a Facebook page for the store to try and sell shoes. So again, starting off in kind of the wild wild was just sharing content, seeing how it worked. So eventually got to the point where we'd be selling a pallet of clothing before it even hit our sales floor. So we were able to kind of develop and and cultivate an audience. Again, this was pre-edering. This was before any algorithms were on Facebook. So everybody saw everything. But we were able to kind of master that and find the organic hay day. Oh my gosh, it was wonderful. It was like shooting fish in a barrel. But we we would have fun with it. Like we'd get a shipment of women's apparel in. I grabbed one of my colleagues and myself and they're like, hey, why don't we take a photo of this of of of what we just got in? And he's like, okay. And I was like, oh, yeah, it's women's clothing too. So be ready. We posted on Facebook and just kind of have some fun with our audience and kind of a reverently joking. But we'd have people commenting saying like, hey, save us save us small for me, save a medium for my daughter. And again, we'd sell out before we'd ever hit the sales floor. Kind of fast forward a few about a year. So I started helping other other retailers and other other companies in the Northwest Arkansas area kind of do that for their own stores. So I eventually started my own small consulting practice with about seven clients at one point and helping kind of them do their so do social media. And they grew. They had a lot of fun. But was lucky enough to be in Northwest Arkansas and met some really smart people there who were kind of in the same I had the same ideas as I did where we wanted to kind of teach how teach those different groups how to do it. So them telling their story is opposed to us telling their story for them teaching them how to fish and them teaching them the skills they need to thrive in the digital space. They would do a lot better. So eventually worked to start a company with a few people in Northwest Arkansas that we were able to kind of grow to a certain extent there had 27 clients or so. And then my wife finished her PhD. So we moved to this area and as opposed to working in an agency I ended up working at Clemson. So fast forward a little bit was a director of social media Clemson and then was it after that director of marketing at a place called Freshwater Systems here in Greenville and then took a step in a different direction. One of the teaching thing and wanting to kind of work with a lot of different groups around the area. So yeah, here I am now and a kind of a war stories from a long period of time working in digital marketing but just kind of the right place at the right time when I got to kind of get my hands dirty early stages and then learning a lot of the skills that would translate into what I think content marketing is and how it can help businesses grow faster than grow more consistently and more sustainably than just about anything else. Yeah, you know a lot there to kind of to build from and I want to get down you know specifically down the content marketing gross strategies so the e-commerce stuff that we tackle every day with some our clients. But you know I think it's fascinating. People talk about it and I certainly hear you know the pros and people that are in marketing every day talk about that or organic versus paid thing but I don't feel like you know for the small to mid-size businesses that we tend you know we're working at all levels here. I don't know that they've quite even still grasped the change that's taken place. The fact that a beautiful picture or a terrible picture or a funny post no matter how great it is sort of the dancing dentist or couple clients that we've hit it helped hit gold with those are exceptions but generally speaking it is paid a play and the organic side that that transition I still don't feel like is mainstream as it should be. Okay so again to put me on a soapbox everything in social and if you're going to find success a lot of it's an arbitrage play it's basically just you're trying to find opportunities where there are not as many and especially like a place like Facebook if you Facebook's like New York if you can make it there you can make it anywhere and if you can start to if you can grow an organic community there that's great that's awesome it's not sustainable and once it changes you've got to stay ahead of the game and ahead of the curve to try and understand what's working what's not and then trying to evolve and change gradually to stay just another step ahead of the curve where you're putting more content kind of paying your dues to the Facebook gods and okay we'll do a Facebook live twice a week so we get a little bit of organic reach around those because they're pumping it through their algorithm really hard or hey LinkedIn video is crushing it right now let's share more video on LinkedIn in between other content that we'll use and I've always done especially from the a Clemson was always focused around selling different parts of the university and talking about different aspects of the university but trying to do that while not feeling stuffy or heavy handed and then trying to keep people engaged in different times in different ways so it's you've got to have a kind of a delicate balance of what's going to work what's not going to work and then always be testing something new and different but again if Facebook's got to monetize their platform they've got to monetize your eyeballs so those that they just tighten the tighten the faucet a little bit tighter a little bit tighter and eventually it's going to kind of basically go away which is kind of the case right now but it's developing an audience and hopefully in some cases moving that audience over to where I like to spend a lot of times email because for the most part Google's a little bit of a diva sometimes in the with their inbox in-box strategy of promotions newsletters and everything's strategy but you likely haven't you have an owned audience there where you're not fighting that algorithm all the time and you own your audience as opposed to Facebook or LinkedIn or Instagram owning your audience where that's going to change and that's going to evolve but if you're learning the skills on those platforms they're going to make you a better marketer so they translate directly to a place like email marketing yeah and do you think that I mean I feel like Instagram's across that you know that bill curve I mean like you said Facebook's only other end of it it's almost that faucet's almost turned off completely you know we're we're what 10% of your active followers probably see your post at best if it's really good and then Instagram's kind of getting there fast as well LinkedIn is still there's some organic opportunity there I believe I see that with my own post and then some of the clients that we have I do still think that there's some organic opportunity but it's just a matter of of time you know they're all going to monetize at the highest level and look you know they exist to make money so I understand why they do it but I think it's it's an important education point for clients or people listening to this understanding what's happening on these platforms and back to your point owning the relationship not owning the customer but owning the relationship and being you know at the forefront of the of the communication channel and having an open dialogue that's not shut down through someone else's control I mean again like going back to early days of Facebook when they first introduced an algorithm or when when when Instagram released an algorithm or their non chronological newsfeed people were just knives and pitchforks out ready to go to battle with Instagram or Facebook but you've got to understand there's so much content nobody can consume all of it so you value either either got to get really good and be the best at what you're doing and in those cases sometimes the cream does rise to the top and where you're going to be able to get your content seen but you've got to really understand how to keep evolving and changing because if what made you successful on Monday is not going to make you successful on Friday and that window is getting smaller smaller all the time and with the kind of the fire hose getting becoming like the small drip eventually you've got to keep moving moving and changing and LinkedIn's got opportunities now because they don't have as much of an established behavior on LinkedIn they're trying to move from what was like the person's digital resume to like LinkedIn used to be really stuffy and boring where it's like a digital resume that nobody really spends time on LinkedIn to where it's a value added platform for people it's still they still need a pipeline of good content to keep people engaged with it because they want people to stay on the platform longer so their eyeballs if if content's good and does drive action their eyeballs are going to keep people there and people are going to use it more and more and it's it's a difficult battle you fight but it's it's something that you kind of have to deal with on those platforms or pay for it which is kind of the case where like Facebook it's like 33 cents of every digital ad dollar spent in the US right now because they are that behemoth they can afford they can really command that command that respect but again marketers are like like Facebook I was I kind of joke about this Facebook or any social platforms like drug dealers like first taste is free next one's going to cost you and they really kind of get people addicted to the eyeballs but then when they turn that off they make those more and more expensive and it you you're kind of seeing this play out on Amazon right now a lot of people are selling products on Amazon where those are Amazon's Amazon's customers and they don't necessarily have any real retention strategy around keeping those customers in the long run because Amazon's they're Amazon's customers they don't have an email they don't have a way to follow up with it's it's Amazon's marketplace yeah that's right Amazon just want to sell more they don't necessarily care more of what yeah no it's and they're taking 15% of those transactions they don't care and then the second time around they're not buying from you again they're buying from Amazon again and they're taking 15% of that and then the more they have to spend through ads there it gets more and more expensive and that ratchet kind of continues to go up and I think let's continue down that path a little bit which is kind of owning your customer relationship I think it that plays right into it it's you know we we end up working a lot of clients that some are already selling on Amazon some are considering it and you know they have any commerce presence but they want to grow it but talk about the the reality of let's go a little deeper on that point with the you know the the Amazon behemoth it is and what you know maybe marketers out there are clients out there that might be listening like you know you dance with the devil you you'll get burned and but under but we we do understand that you know sometimes you do need a flirt it's yeah it's that delicate balance always know like keep your friends enemies closer where if you're spending a lot of time focusing on there you're you need to know it's gonna change like what is gonna find what's gonna be successful today is not gonna be successful tomorrow and they're gradually gonna follow the same trajectory as the social platforms where they want to own more a higher percentage of that transactional revenue every time and Amazon's of different beasts because they're selling ads and selling and they're making at revenue from their ads and from their transaction on every transaction so if you're paying them for ads you're paying them to paying them for a service fee and you may even pay be paying Amazon for warehousing fulfillment you're paying a lot of money for Amazon and they've got this and for hosting your website probably hosting me everything's on Amazon web services like that'll be the next that'll be when like that'll be the next giant company is when they spin out Amazon web services off but you can pay for those eyeballs and pay for that attention but it's not gonna be a long-term game and if it's a reoccurring if it's a reoccurring purchase they also are trying to get private labels into those different spaces really quickly too so you're you're gonna be building your house on rent his land when you're getting into that into that space if again if if that's the direction you want to go in it's a great place is have either a high high amount of I guess hopefully quick eyeballs quick revenue easy way to make a lot of it if you can own that specific category if you're in a really commoditized category it's not gonna be as profitable because you're gonna be playing that commodities game consistently where it's a race to the bottom if you own a specific product category and have a have enough demand to really supplement that then you're gonna be in a a little bit more favorable position that you're not gonna get knocked off but you're eventually gonna get knocked off and Amazon's control maybe the one doing that or a company the outsourcing out of China may do that to you too so depending on the product category there's some opportunity there but a lot of times it's gonna be it it's just not as profitable in the long run and that's where it becomes really difficult to make the value proposition in the long run because if you get become a great Amazon seller eventually maybe you can transition that over to your own platforms but it's a lot harder to do that afterwards when you're kind of become holding to Amazon for a larger portion of your revenue. I love it when you tee up some of my like key points that I talk with clients a lot of time it's called branding and if you do not establish a brand and when I say brand I you know it's not your logo it is your logo but it's not just your logo or your colors and all this and I think you know some people get caught up in that it's the relationship with your customer it's how you make them think feel and act and if you're making them think feel and act to go to Amazon to shop for you because it's quick easy and convenient and there's no real relationship you're in trouble and it's not that you don't want it to be quick easy and efficient but it needs to be done directly with you and you need doing the relationship and you have to do that with establishing the differences that are not commodity driven you know we work with clients that are in that commodity business and it's taking some time to get them to that next level but it's because they have to establish a brand you can't just you know it's not just build it and they will come it's not build you know it's one thing if you can cure cancer great we can sell that you know but if you're not curing cancer and if you're if your product is in a commodity area then you have to build brand you have to build relationship and you have to bring Amazon like experiences underneath your own umbrella and make them feel and be a part of something bigger than just the product so that's where I again kind of regretting it like that's where I love the content marketing side of things because suddenly you can take a niche retailer or a niche group and they can really own an audience they can own a conversation and it's a time where the democratization of what's going on on all these platforms and social is kind of a microcosm of this is if you can build an audience you can drive that audience you see like a like a cally gender I have no bearing on what who I don't know much about cally gender honestly because I'm probably more pop culture literate than it really should be but she she monetizes her social platforms into a beauty line that just grows exponentially and has a valuation of billions of dollars like a glossier starts a blog and then monetizes that blog where it's suddenly one of the most revenue positive businesses around and kind of the goal a direct consumer golden child because they know their audience they can drive leverage that audience and they have passionate group of people that are really devoted to that brand being successful like I had I spoke at a workshop recently where I had somebody who purchased a glossier in that in that room and I started talking about a glossier like case study and that they have a they have a small private slack channel of their super fans where they get a test products before they even hit the shelves and say hey would you buy this would you want to use this and you know how warm and fuzzy though and make it you want to your customer like if they're a super fan they're going to be shouting your name from the rooftops and if you can really own that and be there go to stores for information for relevant for product relevant information relevant products that are going to fit their lifestyle that they can help if your brand can help them tell a story about themselves then you really win and the the brands that are doing it well and the opportunity that I think a lot of the internet offers for them in the consumer space is really exciting because nobody's going to out Amazon Amazon they're going to but you can out human Amazon and that human side of things and that human touch is what's really going to be the different shade for a lot of these groups is if you can develop a human connection with your audience and you can really understand who they are what makes them tick and helps solve some of their problems then you're going to be in a lot more favorable favorable position in the long run because you're you're like a friend that just helped them fix a flat tire like everybody's going to love their friend that helped them fix a flat tire you're that social capital is being built time and time again and you're suddenly in their inbox a few times a week and they love you for it and they they feel it's valuable and I think that's the the difference between you know overwhelming people with marketing message and doing things without any trust or any credibility you know people want to I'll save the the the college kid in in and with his girlfriend analogy that I was going down you know they want they want an instant gratification you know and it takes time and a relationship it takes time to build and trust takes time to build and again unless you have a product that's truly differentiated by the problem that it solves that no other product does are very few products then then you've got to do it through other ways means and ways and and yeah it's like like just closing way too hard it's like that middle school boy that just like can't it's just going in for the cast going in and just like has no business doing what he should be doing and and that's where it's just there's so much there's so much nuance to it but like there's there's a relationship you want to build you want to build that relationship through consistency and not necessarily intensity like it's like a good relationship is probably has good positive quality interactions all year round is opposed like roses and everything and like over the top on just on valentine say and nothing you want to have consistency in that relationship and without that it's really difficult to to maintain it so developing relationships online is no different it's you want to be able to maintain consistently add value add value and if you're helping that person solve their problems if you're helping them kind of understand things differently and you're providing value consistently then they're going to feel differently about making a purchase because there are other come up there are other people who have sold t-shirts before but if you buy t-shirts from the keep person you care about then that's going to be something that you tell that's part of the story you tell about yourself in the value that they bring to you and that's what really I think is so many cases is going to separate so many groups is just their ability to tell their own story and to differentiate themselves from the knowledge they have and just bring that knowledge to the real to the to the real world through digital channels because they've already got it in their head generally but bring it bring it to digital space is really pretty easy for them if you just give them the right tools to do it yeah it brings me I think I was thinking when you were talking like the title of this podcast is going to be civilary is dead but you can do a lot about it I mean like it is true but like it with brands now everybody you know it's easy to start a e-commerce company it's easy to start business you know everybody wants to be an entrepreneur um and they want it yesterday and it can happen but you've got to there's got to be some story there's got to be some relationship building and and that that kind of drip by drip by drip like trust is built in trusted built in drips and lost in buckets and if you can gradually start to build up build up build up and maintain that that it's going to be easier for you to to leverage that audience than it is to just assume hey let's let's just pay for let's pay for everything and assume everybody's going to be here right away because you have to establish a clear value proposition you have to have social proof you have to have a do with a lot of those things you have to do them well and you have to give like just really care about the people you're selling to a lot of time too you have to know who they are intimately and you have to have a really clear understanding of what job that serves for them and if you can do that you're going to be in a lot better place but it takes some time to refine and change and build and build and build but if you're in for the being you know if you're if you want to be an overnight success overnight it's not going to happen if you want to be overnight success after five years then absolutely it's possible but it takes a lot of blood sweat and tears in between and seeing people do social see a lot of people understand what their story is understand who their audience is but then they fall flat on the consistency side of things and that's where it gets really hard because like you see people it's hard to tweet at five o'clock five o'clock on a Friday night like I don't you don't want to you don't care about at that point but if you put it into a system where you're consistently turning out good quality content it's going to pay dividends because you're building relationships you're building an audience you're adding value over time and then you can always improve on it too which is the beauty of it because the stuff you did a year ago is going to be so embarrassing for you you're from now that you're going to be embarrassed of it but you have to start somewhere and that's kind of the beauty of it is you can start trying things and evolving and understanding your audience all the time you should always be learning something what's some practical you know back to you know kind of the overall theme here of content and content building in 2020 I think you've unpacked some of that so far but maybe what's some of the more tactical recommendace is that you'd have for people listening and you know I know you've spoken you know high level philosophically about it but maybe you know if there's any meat and potatoes of practical advice for you know what to do with that next year so I'm I've done this I've been a big fan of this for a while now and just trying to it like make content as easy as possible it doesn't need to be reinventing the wheel every time you do something how easy can you make it like if you're an expert in the subject and the subject you're talking about even just finding a few different like a few different buckets that you want to talk about and then building out a few questions that you get around those buckets all the time like what pain points do people have there consistently and gradually answer those like what questions are are going to help your audience do a better job of what of achieving the goal they have what's what questions do you get on a regular basis that people because if you're getting those questions on a consistent basis there's probably seven other people that had the same question that never got answered and the more you can serve that audience the better you're going to have the better chance you're going to have like go to Google go to answer the public is a source I really like is if you have a topic area you can find frequently asked questions around that topic area and harvest some questions around that and know that hey I have I have customers who like the X area I they have questions around this this and this like in a this is something I did at freshwater systems we would take a product category we would find questions or frequently asked in that category we would answer them we'd have one of our experts answer it in a video there was great because he could just go to town and talk about the things for days he doesn't have time to write a blog post so let's make a video about it let's transcribe that video make trans at that transcription to YouTube because it's going to get indexed going to get search traffic there organically so that automatically grows your audience it's also going to be able to translate really nice into a nice clean blog post with really searchable terms because those are already highly searched questions it's going to drive traffic for you on the organic side in the long tail but it's also something you can distribute your audience because they those are questions they probably have and they probably need those answered and if they see you as the expert then they're going to see you as a valid valid source that information even if they don't see you as that expert if you're solving a problem for them you're going to gradually build that brand equity over time and it doesn't always happen overnight but even if it doesn't translate into revenue coming in right away it's still value value value you can add then when you do need to ask for a sale you can and like in that in that case like we had an expert talking about anything and everything water and he would just go to town talking about these things he's super nerdy about like I don't get as nerdy as he does about it but are there's a community of people that did and eventually like we'd send those out as an email and they'd make thousands of dollars and thousands of dollars in a day and then we can automate that into it into an email automation system where if you purchase in that category you're going to get this eventually so you make sure that content is going to live live a few different in a few different forms so you can really maximize the opportunity there but you're just answering the questions of people that ask you all the time and it's kind of the like the market shared in like they ask you answer and it doesn't have to be perfect does have to be rocket science even if you just suck at it just try it and I'm truthfully like I'm always the I always get on myself because I'm always a cobbler who whose children has no shoes I need to do a lot better job myself personally but put it into a calendar do it every week make it consistent and use that as a piece that you do at hey every every Wednesday at 1.30 I'm going to be writing this from 1.32 or 1.30 to 4 and really just add it into your calendar and add it as a consistent piece but suddenly you have something you could use to reach your audience on a weekly basis and really trickle out content that is valuable for them and hopefully if you can serve serve them consistently they're going to need to eventually make a purchase in your category or for your product and it might as well be you that's in their inbox on a consistent basis where hey if you help if they help with workout ideas I suddenly have workout information I can use if I'm suddenly use that on a consistent basis and find more value in it it's I'm going to be purchasing from you on a much more regular consistent basis I think the biggest thing of everything you said is making it easy and staying consistent with it because I think what happens is for a lot of people they throw a lot of hooks out there they do a few things they do it for 30 days or 60 days and they you know take all the advice and then they don't see the immediate either ROI or followers or whatever the metric is blog views you know and they go oh it's not working and I think you know that's back to the relationship over time it's the consistency of that that I think is so so key to making it work like when you get married to somebody after after after a month like like probably not like like like maybe they're there there are those one those those edge cases that people who love first site but generally it's not going to be like that like you're going to have to build a relationship over time and it Rome wasn't built in a day and you've got to gradually kind of chip way that and the consistency it's 12 to 18 months before any real content program is going to be successful because you've got to do your kissing frogs you've got to understand how to like what you want your goal needs needs to be who your audience is and how to reach that audience and solve their problems once you've kind of honed in on that you can you can do a lot better job if you have a clear understanding of what problem you're solving on the front end it makes it easier because you're not trying to run around with a key you don't have a key that you're running around trying to find a lock that fits into you're a person that has a key that has a lock that you're actually with a key to so you know who you're shooting for and who your audience necessarily is but if if you're starting from from ground zero it's going to take a long long time and that's where putting in the blood sweat tears takes a while I was when I worked at Clemson one of the people I always spoke with Jonathan Gantt who runs all the Clemson he said he was headed up all of their like Clemson football content and they do a rage out with content just across the board they really have established the Clemson brand nationally and again it was really fun getting to work with people like that but everybody be like oh Clemson football just blew up overnight and he was like no absolutely not like this took years and years of blood sweat and tears it really sucked before they were able to make it into something that was great but by the time they were they had all of the operating systems in place to really ramp things up and continue things so that's where kind of you have to have those those foundational pieces where you can keep the keep the donuts churning and keep that keep that content process consistent and if you can do it on a weekly basis it's great if you knew it on a buy if you can do it more than once a week that's even better but you see all the youtubers finding success with like one video a week as a piece of pub content they may have one or two other things in addition to that but just that consistency makes a huge a world of difference and in finding a way to distribute that in a meaningful way on top of that it's really important sorry I like I said I can go onto a soapbox for days I love it I love it I wouldn't teach this yet if I didn't really love it because like it's exciting I mean it's it's so much is changing so quickly and if we can continue to kind of stay on the stay on the forefront of this is really fun for me so I love it and I'm excited to unpack a few more topics in future I'm gonna you know arm wrestle you into doing this you know maybe a couple of times a month and I mean I think it's important you know we're we're talking our clients about this you know you come in on the strategy side and coach our clients but I think it's important for us to get out there because your knowledge base and your passion around it is so obvious and I think you know we still got a lot to unpack here I mean yeah I could talk for days and when I'm not doing this I normally am like always in a lot of podcasts and a lot of other information because I just I like learning about the stuff so cool we'll Rob I appreciate you coming on and I look forward to the next one that went by really fast so I appreciate Ryan and yeah we'll have some fun we'll see you next time yo guys what's up Ryan offered here thanks so much for listening really appreciative it do us a favor if you've been enjoying the red cast you need to share the word with a friend or anyone else we'd really appreciate it and go leave us a review at Apple or Spotify it was a solid tell more people leave us some reviews and hey here's the best news of all if you want to work with me directly you want to get your business kicking ass and you want radical or myself involved you can text me directly at eight six four seven two nine three six eight zero don't wait another minute let's get your business going eight six four seven two nine thirty six eighty we'll see you next time